Peace in education

[JBen]

3 years ago contracts were stripped under a new Ontario law. Teachers have not had a contract since then. My other half is a teacher so I see the communiques that are shared from the Unions. I'm not a great lover of unions but I can see what they are currently fighting.
The government came to the table with further reductions and stripping items out of their previous contract.....that's not going to go well for any employee group especially when our illustrious govt sees fit to give the OPP an 8.5% raise over 3 years….

The OPPs raise is covered by the municipalities, not QP. It was an easy way to give out some love buy some favor support (their favorite thing) without paying the price themselves. Politically a brilliant move. This though means that many rural communities are having to jack land taxes substantially. Imagine being a senior on a fixed income with soaring hydro and land taxes and..Or living in one of those area’s hit hard by job losses (plants, manufacturing)

If the Unions haven’t signed the contracts presented back in 2011? Why, what the heck is the problem?
If memory serves me right, banked sick days was the primary issue back then. And the reason that was/is an issue is because.
1) After banking years worth Teachers were calling in sick when they weren’t and using them
2) After banking years worth Teachers were using them as small golden parachutes

I get it, teachers do need sick time. They work in environments….
Fine make sure based on historical averages they have enough per year. But banked? Get real, this isn’t the 1970s anymore.

I do get it, as Ive said I have friends/family that are teachers. Do “they” not realize the state of things and are they unwilling to do what they can or should? Especially given they have helped create the mess..And prior to 2010 were the recipients of over spending/over hiring?

/dons facetious hat
Maybe if they all took a 3% or 5% haircut, or if just those above the duo income mean took a 5% haircut. Maybe if there weren’t 90 teachers in Hamilton on the Sunshine list, or that one elementary teacher on it (who somehow earned $200,000 in 2014)

$200,0000 alone could hire 3 young teachers.

There would be money for smaller classrooms (20 per, and maybe young kids wouldn’t be home with a lot of HW and would instead get to spend quality time with their parents). Maybe many of those young teachers on contracts could get hired full time. And teachers (Unions) wouldn’t be complaining that the govt doesn’t have the money to give our kids the education they deserve.

/food for thought

Correct me if I’m wrong.
Many accepted a 2% or a 2.5% raise last time around. I know there was one that balked at that, didn’t feel it was enough, didn’t sign….that was the one Ms Wynne handed 500mm to along with the OPPs raise to buy their “labor peace”…Too bloody bad, imo.

divide $500,000,000 by $50,000
How many new full time teachers is that?

And for those that did accept the 2%-2.5%. Thats still well above what most of the real world has and is getting.

[krakadawn]

Banked days can be an issue in many other jobs. All municipal employees along with any prov/federal employees in this area all bank days. Even the guys who work for the public works have a banking system that is paid out at retirement. I'm not sure teachers were abusing this or not, have never seen any stats on this. I did see coverage on Global news about Federal employees and sick days etc, concern was for a very high average of absenteeism.

Can't agree with your comment on whether they agree on the state of things. Fly that idea to any employee group you want, you wont get support.

In regards to a teacher making 200k, that's got to be an error. I just checked the salary grid for both elementary and secondary in this area, no where near. Published salary of Directors of Education for both the public and separate boards not even making that.

The Province opened negotiations with 'stripping' items only once again. I'm sure most of you would welcome your current contract stripped of previously negotiated items without arbitration or negotiation.....sure go ahead and line up for that!

If the Province is in a bad way then start treating ALL employee groups the same. No $$ for increases then fine, hold the line for everyone. Let's not hand out signing bonuses for certain police groups even though they are experienced(what a novel idea) and perhaps we might look at the ridiculos spending of our tax dollars within the ranks of Hydro ONE. Salaries and benefits off the wall with this group.

[Hunter John]

Banked days can be an issue in many other jobs. All municipal employees along with any prov/federal employees in this area all bank days. Even the guys who work for the public works have a banking system that is paid out at retirement. I'm not sure teachers were abusing this or not, have never seen any stats on this. I did see coverage on Global news about Federal employees and sick days etc, concern was for a very high average of absenteeism.

Can't agree with your comment on whether they agree on the state of things. Fly that idea to any employee group you want, you wont get support.

In regards to a teacher making 200k, that's got to be an error. I just checked the salary grid for both elementary and secondary in this area, no where near. Published salary of Directors of Education for both the public and separate boards not even making that.

The Province opened negotiations with 'stripping' items only once again. I'm sure most of you would welcome your current contract stripped of previously negotiated items without arbitration or negotiation.....sure go ahead and line up for that!

If the Province is in a bad way then start treating ALL employee groups the same. No $$ for increases then fine, hold the line for everyone. Let's not hand out signing bonuses for certain police groups even though they are experienced(what a novel idea) and perhaps we might look at the ridiculos spending of our tax dollars within the ranks of Hydro ONE. Salaries and benefits off the wall with this group.

Off the wall with all most groups under government control.

[Hunter John]

http://surlyhamiltonian.blogspot.ca/...ct-school.html

This is the 2013 sunshine list for the board where I am employed. 322 teacher on the list. Also many other sunshine lists can be seen on the right of the page.

[JBen]

Can't agree with your comment on whether they agree on the state of things. Fly that idea to any employee group you want, you wont get support.

When things went south in 2008.
How many companies reduced cost? Found ways to save cost, either by nixing "perks" or benefits?
Answer: Thousands.

~How many companies reduced bonuses (mine did, and each and everyone us understood the need. I took a 40% haircut....Also understood that by doing so no one would get laid off....and none were).......you were saying?

~How many reduced salaries: Thousands.

Would you like hundreds/thousands of examples of many doing just that?
Problem is, merely mention such novel concepts and Unions go ballistic.

[quote]

THis is just Markham. And this is just scratching the surface.

In education, 565 elementary and secondary teachers, principals, superintendents and administrators at the York Region District School Board earned more than $100,000 last year. An increase from 443 people last year.
Ken Thurston, the public school board’s director of education, raked in nearly $294,000, up from his salary of $268,000 last year.

565 people from 443 last year
plus 27%

Ken Thurston saw his salary go up 9.7%
What world do these people live in..Most tax payers are lucky to get 1.75% these days

565 x $100,000 (and this doesn't include benefits or Pensions) = $56,500,000
Now, just for illustrative purposes, lets say those 565 man upped, realized that compared to the mean family earning a total of 75,000 without pensions, they are in another world.

And trimmed a whopping 2% ($2,000 each)
$56,500,000 x .02 = $1,130,000 saved
Enough to hire/pay 20 Teachers at $50,000.

http://www.yorkregion.com/community-...unshine-list-/

Here's Hamilton
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilt...100k-1.1359492

Have a read and this is why arbitration isn't the answer either.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/sunshi...down-1.2592793

And as for that Elementary teacher, no it's not an error. Cant find the article in the press about him/her but it's out there if you care to search.

Of coarse its always so much easier to look anywhere but internally.

[M_P]

Banked days can be an issue in many other jobs. All municipal employees along with any prov/federal employees in this area all bank days. Even the guys who work for the public works have a banking system that is paid out at retirement. I'm not sure teachers were abusing this or not, have never seen any stats on this. I did see coverage on Global news about Federal employees and sick days etc, concern was for a very high average of absenteeism.

Can't agree with your comment on whether they agree on the state of things. Fly that idea to any employee group you want, you wont get support.

In regards to a teacher making 200k, that's got to be an error. I just checked the salary grid for both elementary and secondary in this area, no where near. Published salary of Directors of Education for both the public and separate boards not even making that.

The Province opened negotiations with 'stripping' items only once again. I'm sure most of you would welcome your current contract stripped of previously negotiated items without arbitration or negotiation.....sure go ahead and line up for that!

If the Province is in a bad way then start treating ALL employee groups the same. No $$ for increases then fine, hold the line for everyone. Let's not hand out signing bonuses for certain police groups even though they are experienced(what a novel idea) and perhaps we might look at the ridiculos spending of our tax dollars within the ranks of Hydro ONE. Salaries and benefits off the wall with this group.

There has been outcry about all of the foolish spending that this government has done. Anyone with half a brain new that cuts were coming after the election no matter who got in but if the OPP had not gotten their way Kate would be in jail by now so they got their raise. It's unfortunate for the teachers and anyone else who has cuts on the horizon that they don't wield that kind of power. Hudak made the mistake of making his intentions known. The libs, rainbows and unicorns for everyone before the election and get the knife out after. Just add it to the long list of deceit and lies that this government has told.

[JBen]

Just on the banking of sick days.
That is an outrageously expensive, outdated perk. Arent "teachers" adequately compensated already? Pensions? Don't they have medical insurance?

No argument they certain a certain amount (X) of sick time per year.
The real world when allotted sick time isn't enough goes on Short Term Disability (usually 70% of salary)
What a novel concept.

So this strike which from what I can glean from the Unions is about the govt not having enough to give our children the educations they deserve, and classroom sizes.

great, do something about it.. It would be ridiculousy easy to find the money in order to be able hire a boatload of more teachers and have classrooms of 20/per.
See above

[terrym]

Another thing they need to do away with is bringing back retired teachers as subs. No teacher drawing a pension should be allowed to return as long as a single qualified/certified teacher is unemployed. The Substitute gigs are gravy and quite often get given to friends of the school principal or admins. I know one neighbor of mine who makes a great living subbing in my local elementary school. 90% of the time she is always the sub called in. There is no way in hell we don't have 100's of qualified teachers out bussing tables who need the work and hours.
As for banking sick days it should be eliminated immediately. If legitimately ill and needing time off then they should also be given what is needed. Of course teachers are exposed to more germs than most adults and likely get sick alot. But when you have a union that bleeds the taxpayers like they do they end up with scenarios where there is no latitude or empathy and they get the contract minimum. If they don't like the sick day package they can only blame themselves. In my firm we had an employee get to take a year off with pay to care for his wife who was dieing of cancer. He was allowed to completely pull off the road, keep his company car and do minimal office work based from home. If we were in a union environment where there were threats of job actions this man would have been laid off. When we work weekends and nights or have to travel outside business hours we don't nickel and dime the company, it is understood that work to be done gets done end of discussion. The other side of that coin is we don't get watched and questioned about our time management. We don't get the work done they hire someone who will. You get what you sow. If these self entitled union people treated taxpayers with respect they would get it back in return.

[krakadawn]

Terry, better check with your local Board to see their process. They are very outdated if that kind of thing takes place. I checked with our Board....first you apply to have your name on the list if you are qualified. You could be retired or not, must be interviewed first and accepted.
When a teacher books ill, the automated call system does a call out for a replacement. There is a process to accept so the school knows the position is filled and also who is coming.
No favourites or buddies.
A Principal may contact an individual if the system comes up vacant...only then.

Do you get any sick days under your contract? What happens if you don't use them? Maybe you aren't under any kind of a contract.

The teacher haters might want to trot down to your local municipality and ask questions about all your PUC workers, snow plow drivers, hole diggers etc....you might be surprised at the benefits they are receiving and broaden your horizons about who you are ticked off with...and I'll bet they are all unionized.

[terrym]

Terry, better check with your local Board to see their process. They are very outdated if that kind of thing takes place. I checked with our Board....first you apply to have your name on the list if you are qualified. You could be retired or not, must be interviewed first and accepted.
When a teacher books ill, the automated call system does a call out for a replacement. There is a process to accept so the school knows the position is filled and also who is coming.
No favourites or buddies.
A Principal may contact an individual if the system comes up vacant...only then.

Do you get any sick days under your contract? What happens if you don't use them? Maybe you aren't under any kind of a contract.

The teacher haters might want to trot down to your local municipality and ask questions about all your PUC workers, snow plow drivers, hole diggers etc....you might be surprised at the benefits they are receiving and broaden your horizons about who you are ticked off with...and I'll bet they are all unionized.

Call it what you want but it is exactly what happens and I guarantee you it happens all over the Province in most schools. With it being so hard to land teaching jobs in Ontario interestingly my buddies daughter in law got hired right after graduation. The fact her father was a retired Principal and her mother and sister also are teachers I guess is pure coincidence right? I guess there weren't any unemployed grads in the Cambridge school district? You can quote all the rules you want but if there is no will to abide by them or enforce them it means nothing. This government pretty well gives the finger to us everyday. It was illegal to wipe the hard drives of incriminating evidence with the gas plants. It was illegal to try and bribe a candidate in the Sudbury byelection. Do you think for a minute that they care about substitute teacher rules?