CTV news is reporting a school shooting of two people with the shooter in custody in the north of the province on a First Nations Denne reserve. Here we go.............:sad:
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CTV news is reporting a school shooting of two people with the shooter in custody in the north of the province on a First Nations Denne reserve. Here we go.............:sad:
Hope everyone is ok.
5 confirmed dead. no story on motive or shooter. suspect in custody.
Wow not good ...5 dead ..
Here we go is right !!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
Sad indeed. Condolences to the community.
I was kind of surprised to hear the media quoting Trudeau from Davos for updates. What's going on there?
First,thanks for moving this,Rugger. Now,we're up to 5 victims,hopefully,the other 2 will be alright. This is in a sleepy little town. It shows this stuff can happen,anywhere.
edit: Apparently,LaLoche isn't such a sleepy little town. A friend who was stationed there with the RCMP says it's tough as hell and crime is rampant from abject poverty and total political corruption. My friend is surprised it hasn't happened before now. Maybe,it's time for the government to get their act together. They've been fancy-footing around this crap for decades.
Is it up to governments or the reserves to clean things up? Defining who's responsible and accepting and implementing the solutions that is where the real problem is.
About 5 years ago a fellow I know was teaching school just south of LaLoche in the same school district. He was offered a teaching position in LaLoche. 3 of the native teachers he was working with warned him not to go. They told him it was a bad place to be.
Gun control is what I think that's all about. Prime minister Justin and the liberals will try to capitalize on this big time. The poor victims will be forgotten and the anti gun movement will be reborn. My thoughts and prayers go out to the victims and they're families.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wahoo
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Fre
Right now we guarantee that a sociopath will have no opposition when they start a shooting spree. This simple fact could be changed if the politicians agreed. If they were using fire bombs things would be harder....
It's a Dene indian reserve of 3000 people. I wouldn't suspect it to be a "quiet little town".
The first two victims were the shooter's siblings. So there's likely a store we don't know with a pretty clear motive.
Expect the usual rhetoric to start this week. The shooter must have used a long gun of some type because they haven't released that info. Had it been a "black" gun it would be plastered in the media by now. Now how you can expect to remove hunting guns from a remote Indian reserve is beyond me so they will target those that aren't a menace instead and then people will feel good. Same thing happened after the Polytechnic massacre. I am in no way trying to downplay these tragedies, but we can easily predict how this will play out. Maybe they can include climate change to this, thats big these days.
One of the articles I read online this am said it was a shotgun. Can't find the link.
You're right. The reality is that had the gun been an AR of some kind and this dad event had taken place in southern Ontario, the dialogue would already be different.Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
Trudeau, barely 3 months into his term, is possibly facing his first defining moment. It just so happens that this occurred in a largely first Nations community with higher-than-the-national-average rates of suicide. Trudeau's political "out" in this case is to make grand announcements about major new investments and programs in First Nations health care, social services and community economic development, as follow through on his election promises surrounding rebuilding the relationship with First Nations.
Yup. And trust me they will spin that quickly and loud. I do find some of the facts interesting in the reports so far. They have said there were 900 students in this school and 100 teachers. A 9/1 teacher pupil ratio seems way above normal, maybe someone can correct me. Also that school looks every bit as nice as you would find around here so I'm not sure if under funding education is the root cause of a tragedy like this? I'm thinking alcohol and drug use, broken family units are going to be the case. I have to wonder how the money given gets spent? Harper had introduced legislation to make band expenditures transparent but that is one if the first things JT is reversing. Not sure how hiding how tax money gets spent is progressive. In fact it stinks and implies collusion with people trying to hide things but that did bring votes I guess.
So with a 17 year old in custody for the shooting, one could draw the conclusion that Dayne Fontaine's twin brother was the shooter.
Motive is always a mystery: Was it homicide-suicide pack, if so, why involve the school? Was it the school and the other two brothers attempted to stop it? May it was the former and the shooter couldn't do himself in, so he went to the school to see if he could draw the RCMP into taking him out. It will be interesting to see what exactly was behind the whole affair. Then, of course, there is the matter of having access to the gun that was used. In a northern communities, where there is hunting, and predators abound, improper storage is not likely to be that much of an issue. The kid may even have had a Minors Licence. What could possibly have prevented this sad tragedy.
You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut
I'll disagree with this conclusion. If identifying the twin would lead to identifying the perpetrator, that would be a no-go under the YCJA.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gun Nut
I'm not so sure I agree,terry. The Liberals may be willing to keep their collective traps slammed shut vis-a-vie gun control because it will open them up to being forced to meet the First Nations poverty/corruption/drug abuse catastrophe,head on, across the entire nation. Especially for Liberals,they're loathe to open that "racism" can of worms and have it explode in their face. Believe me,before they ever point the fingers at us,they better be prepared for the shyte storm that will surely follow.Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
Maybe just maybe it is time this first Nation situation should be ripped wide open .I am a card carrying metis Aboriginal status .I don't get any of the benefits hunting rights or tax breaks ..Mayby it's time the whole deal was put before the people of Canada and worked out in a fair and equally way. One law one rule one people. CANADIAN .. this is just a opinion. My two cents ..D
they already have special status. Why would they ever give that up? But I do agree the present system makes no sense. Paying off people to be isolated on remote reserves doesn't exactly work does it? Yes, it's time to assimilate them into the modern world.Quote:
Originally Posted by dutchhunter
Assimilate, you mean like the school controversy? :silly: Well how about we live up to our end of the bargain, and give them all the land we signed treaties (legal binding contract) for so long ago.:ashamed: Then give them no more money, but let them run their land as they see fit.:thumbup: Fat chance of that.:scream: Discuss.:rolleye:
x2Quote:
Originally Posted by dutchhunter
the problem is that the people don't know how much is wrong there; e.g. domestic violence, drug abuse, corruption etc.
I'm pretty sure most folks up there and down here would like to change things to the better, but that would require publicly showing the problem (politically a very high risk).
No it mean giving them what they are owed, and no government wants to do that.
Have you ever heard of The White Paper on Indian Affairs written by The Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development? Google it and take a read. It's brilliant and was instantly suppressed by the government of the day which was surprising considering it was written by Jean Chretien. Political Correctness was rearing it's ugly head during the Pierre Trudeau regime,too. It's a classic example of liberalist systemic policy paralyses caused by PC.Quote:
Originally Posted by fishermccann
...and what are they owed???Quote:
Originally Posted by fishermccann
The government has been pouring billions into indian and northern affairs and the problems still exist.
It's not a money problem its a culture and isolation issue. No hope no future.
The last serious attempt to try to resolve these problems is now referred to as the "residential school system".
So please excuse the rest of Canada from trying to actively to "help", we didn't get a lot of thanks last time.
This is a native problem and they need to resolve it themselves.
Exactly! Maybe,it's time we simply keep our noses out of it.....completely....meaning no more federal tax money,either,not one nickle,ever,seeing as how we made such a mess of things and it's all our fault,right?Quote:
Originally Posted by werner.reiche
Quote:
Originally Posted by trimmer21
I agree , but wait for the railway lines to be shut down / highways /bridges .ect. The system is broke but I don't believe any government will have the stomach for it nor do I believe the FN want things to change.
What are they owed... how about 25% of Canada that they have signed contracts for, with the ruling government of the day.Quote:
Originally Posted by werner.reiche
Maybe we should all go back to the countries we immigrated from right? How long do you think they would survive without us? Go back through time and people, societies were overthrown by war non stop. Still happens and never will stop. Like our brilliant PM likes to say. It's 2015. Time for "everybody" to take some responsibility for themselves and to join the modern world.
Then again maybe DiCaprio, Bono or Niel Younge will solve all the problems right?
BUT they did not lose a war , we just failed to honour our contracts. They did not fight us ,they were on our side against the French and Americans.. Do you not know Canadian history? Or choose to ignore what parts you do not like. Also, ' how long do you think they would survive without us', sounds condescending to me, and could be construed as racism.
I guess what I am saying is that it is time to open all the books windows and doors. Let the people of Canada know how much is being given to the reservations show us were are tax dollars are being spent .what we have been doing for the last 60 years is not working for anybody.time for change .one of my dad's best friends is a native .he worked as a iron worker is whole life retired with a great pention in a beautiful new home with a new truck for himself and a new car for his wife who worked as a nurse till she retired. There home is payed for and thy have no debt .and live a great life with there kids and grand kids. It all comes down to choice. D
that means you don't like Quebec - what does that make you?Quote:
Originally Posted by fishermccann
...or wait a second, didn't the French have a very different strategy with dealing with the natives than the English? as you side with the English, what does that make you?
...or did you just choose that part of history that suits your argument rather than the reality? what would that make you then?
It is the left who don't want that people are treated equal - put that entire racist BS (and so called political correctness) aside and you'll see that nobody would need them anymore.
Some FN helped England defeat the French in North America then the Americans trying to move north . If I sided with the English in those past days, it makes me Canadian. No I am not a FN person, I just see an injustice that was done and continues to done, by reneging on signed deals.
If you can show which "agreements were reneged on" which already haven't been settled in Court,I'd sure like to see them. I submit that the only ones that haven't been settled are really issues which have arisen in the past 20 years which were never covered under any treaty or agreement in the past.Quote:
Originally Posted by fishermccann
It's a very sad situation and complicated problem. I wish some leader ( aboriginal and federal govt.) could make some inroads into making life better for aboriginal folk , but I don't expect to see it in my life time.
Read the other day that First Nations folk weren't allowed to vote until 1960. Unbelievable.
No that would make you a BRITISH SUBJECT living in the EMPIRE OF BRITANNICA. RULE BRITANNICA RULE! and all that good stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by fishermccann
Would you stick to that if they put in a land claim for property you own?Quote:
Originally Posted by fishermccann
Fishermccan, here is my take on it, to my knowledge I have no FN blood coursing through my veins, also I've read quite a bit of the early history of the north American continent. We are their tenants, the FN are our landlord. Sadly, they have to keep taking us to court in order for them to get the rent we owe them. Our understanding was, all we had to do is to my a treaty with them and we could buy them out, and own this land. Their understanding was that we treated for the use of this land and not the ownership, and when we treated, we agreed to perpetually pay them rent as long as the sun shall rise. J T father when he repatriated our constitution invited Quebec to the table, but was up for giving the FN nothing. He withdrew that idea after a few supreme court judges had a talk with him. I can imagine what they said to him. However, did you ever wonder why it is that we get shut down every time we start a conversation about establishing any type of private property rights.
You don't stop hunting because you grow old. You grow old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut
They could always vote - if they gave up their treaty rights. The 1960 vote was to allow treaty Indians to vote.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharon
Actually giving them the vote, is merely another attempt to assimilate them. If you are the landlord what could you possibly hope to gain by voting for a tenant association board? Oh, maybe the FN by voting, could vote in a tenant association board, who would persuade the tenants to get their rents up to date, and quite falling into arrears. What's the chance of that happening? They are probably further ahead to keep taking the tenants to court, and seeking a judgement in order to get their rent.
You don't stop hunting because you get old. You get old because you stop hunting.
- Gun Nut