Outdoor wood boiler

Looking into installing an outdoor boiler for our tenant. We both burn wood anyway, with electric backup and our wood all comes from the same source.
I have had three salesmen/professional installers look at our site and they ALL say to put it in the same spot. My wife happened to speak with the building inspector who gave her a checklist which will eliminate the preferred spot.....for the same reasons we chose it in the first place.
We want it sheltered from the wind and rain with a covered wood supply close by. The inspector wants it out in the open with no wood within ten feet..and thirty feet from ANY buildings, including woodsheds. Looking at my neighbours it's kinda obvious none of them got a building permit..:rolleyes:

Didn't realize you need a building permit to install a outdoor boiler. My building inspector has been at my place at least 4 times since I installed mine and he has walked by it every time and never once said anything about it. I actually just took ownership of a new one 2 weeks ago that will heat the house and my new shop. It's going between the two structures with it being closer to the shop and next to the wood shed.

What did you do with your old one?

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Originally Posted by gooseman

Didn't realize you need a building permit to install a outdoor boiler. My building inspector has been at my place at least 4 times since I installed mine and he has walked by it every time and never once said anything about it. I actually just took ownership of a new one 2 weeks ago that will heat the house and my new shop. It's going between the two structures with it being closer to the shop and next to the wood shed.

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They want to know what to tax you on, if you add then they will up your taxes, if you remove things they will probably up your taxes.

You need to permit to replace deck boards in some municipalities.

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Originally Posted by Fox

They want to know what to tax you on, if you add then they will up your taxes, if you remove things they will probably up your taxes.

You need to permit to replace deck boards in some municipalities.

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ya you are probably right. I just never thought you would need a permit for an outside wood stove with no structure around it and not really a permanent structure in itself.
As for the old one I will probly be putting it on kijiji soon. It's made by heiss heaters in Michigan. Gave me plenty of heat for last 5 yrs just not big enough for a 2000 sq shop and 2000sq house upstairs and basement. House and basement was plenty but shop probly not enough but' to maintain temps. If your interested Google heiss heaters and pm me

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Originally Posted by patvetzal

Looking into installing an outdoor boiler for our tenant. We both burn wood anyway, with electric backup and our wood all comes from the same source.
I have had three salesmen/professional installers look at our site and they ALL say to put it in the same spot. My wife happened to speak with the building inspector who gave her a checklist which will eliminate the preferred spot.....for the same reasons we chose it in the first place.
We want it sheltered from the wind and rain with a covered wood supply close by. The inspector wants it out in the open with no wood within ten feet..and thirty feet from ANY buildings, including woodsheds. Looking at my neighbours it's kinda obvious none of them got a building permit..:rolleyes:

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I think the Province allowed municipalities to develop and impose their own regulations and by-laws for installation of outdoor wood boilers. Anything in writing from your by-law office? My building inspector didn't mention it any permit required, but I haven't installed it yet either.

I would also call your insurance company, as they may have a required setback from dwellings. I think I was told 30ft for that when I asked my broker. Chimney height was also a consideration based on how close your neighbours house is.

Funny you mention insurance, my agent when he came out to see my new shop asked about heating it. I explained the outdoor boiler and he is from town and couldn't understand how it worked. He was insisting I needed to get it certified and inspected and my rates were going up and on and on. I took him by the hand and showed him the only thing that connects the house and boiler is hot water. Then he went on about what if the water line blows, I will be flooded. Couldn't understand it was a closed system 300 gals of water at the most if the pump spills everything into the basement. Finally he said "oh I see" and he finally relaxed and wrote it in the policy as an external boiler system used as a backup with no mention of it being wood fired since my main furnace is propane he put that down as our primary heat.
Dont have to worry about stack height here as the nearest neighbour is about 5000ft away and he has a boiler too.

They are becoming more popular down here in the rural areas - but one thing I see happening is where someone puts in a furnace and it smokes a neighbor out - sometimes it ends up in court - their is a guy with one down the road from me - I'm too far away so it doesn't affect me but sometimes I look down at his place when he is burning it and I can't see his house or barn from all the smoke surrounding them - but yes they would sure cut your heating bill -

The new gasification ones can be as efficient as a similar wood stove. The older ones burnt a lot more wood because they could not get the firebox hot enough to burn the smoke.
Either way, they are only as cheap as the cost of your fuel...we have 80 acres of bush.

In many places now, you are required to install an boiler that meets the newer EPA standard for maximum particulate matter:

0.32 lb/MMBtu heatoutput for outdoor HH in2013 (NSPS)3 0.15 lb/mmBTU heatoutput for both indoor and outdoorHydronic Heating in 2016 (NSPS)

The CSA requirements are more stringent CSA B415.10 with 0.4 g/MJ for indoor boilers and furnaces, and 0.13 g/MJ for outdoor boilers and furnaces. There is no requirement to meet the CSA standard, unless your municipality or province has made it mandatory.

Several states have gone to the EPA standard, but grandfather older units.

You pretty much cannot reach any of those numbers without a gasification unit.

If there's a lot of smoke, they are definitely pumping out a lot of particulate matter. Those court cases happen here too. There was one in here in Ontario a few years back. I don't know if it was resolved, as the last I read the homeowner was told by the judge to stop using the unit until the situation was resolved, but I did not see the followup documents. The OWB owner had already spent about $3000 trying to move and retrofit the installation to improve the smoke issue.

Not sure what type of boiler you want to install but all I heard was you needs lots of wood,strong arms and like shoveling snow..... I always wanted one until I talked to a few guys that owned one, must of them don't anymore or want to get ride of it, including guys with endless wood supply and power equipment.

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Originally Posted by seabast

Not sure what type of boiler you want to install but all I heard was you needs lots of wood,strong arms and like shoveling snow..... I always wanted one until I talked to a few guys that owned one, must of them don't anymore or want to get ride of it, including guys with endless wood supply and power equipment.

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I can not think of one person that owns one that would get rid of theirs. I know of at least 20 different people that have them and all different brands. Yes some do eat wood and some are better. My old unit I would put about 6 pcs of ash approx 12-16" dia and 16-18" long and that would last 24 hrs on the coldest nights keeping the house at a nice 72* and costing nothing but the fan and circulation pump and my time in the bush cutting.
my new stove hasn't had a fire in it yet so I can't say how it will do with wood consumption. As for shovelling snow, I don't understand that one? What does that have to do with the boiler?

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Originally Posted by seabast

Not sure what type of boiler you want to install but all I heard was you needs lots of wood,strong arms and like shoveling snow..... I always wanted one until I talked to a few guys that owned one, must of them don't anymore or want to get ride of it, including guys with endless wood supply and power equipment.

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My coworker burns 13 cords of wood in his on a bad winter.

Mind you, he doesn't bother much with making sure that his wood is seasoned. He would burn a lot less if he didn't burn it green or wet.

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Originally Posted by gooseman

I can not think of one person that owns one that would get rid of theirs. I know of at least 20 different people that have them and all different brands. Yes some do eat wood and some are better. My old unit I would put about 6 pcs of ash approx 12-16" dia and 16-18" long and that would last 24 hrs on the coldest nights keeping the house at a nice 72* and costing nothing but the fan and circulation pump and my time in the bush cutting.
my new stove hasn't had a fire in it yet so I can't say how it will do with wood consumption. As for shovelling snow, I don't understand that one? What does that have to do with the boiler?

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To access the wood and your boiler you need to plow the snow, but it will depend how much snow you get where you live. All I got from people I personally talked to, not on the internet, wasn't positive beside the fact you can burn any kinds of wood.

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Originally Posted by seabast

To access the wood and your boiler you need to plow the snow, but it will depend how much snow you get where you live. All I got from people I personally talked to, not on the internet, wasn't positive beside the fact you can burn any kinds of wood.

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You have to plow snow to get to your car or truck too, I don't see it as that different as having to keep a path clear for the delivery guys to top off the propane.

Grandpa had one near Kapuskasing, it had an oil backup so he could leave and it would still keep his house warm.

You can go through a lot of wood or very little, it all depends on how you run your life at home.
He had a shed made around the furnace so that he could have 2-3 face cords of wood ready to go, all he had to do was open the door (swing in) and fill up the stove, never had a problem. It worked so well my uncle put one in as well. They burned almost exclusively tamarak in these stoves.

Mine sits in the middle of a gravelled area about 30' x 40' with the one end stacked with wood ( or at least that's where the wood is supposed to be) and the tractor can get anywhere around it to scoop the snow away if it gets blown in. The snow has never been a problem yet and can't see it being a real problem as most people put these along their driveway so they can back a trailer up to them or close by.

10-15 face cord seems to be the norm around here that I hear of and even buying it all at $45-60 a face compared to propane or hydro that's considerable cheap

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Originally Posted by gooseman

10-15 face cord seems to be the norm around here that I hear of and even buying it all at $45-60 a face compared to propane or hydro that's considerable cheap

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From people I know around here, they burn about 7-9 full cords a year. The guy burning 13 was full cords too, but I mentioned his issue with poor wood. He burns full logs as well, so he takes an efficiency hit there too.

I estimated that I should be able to get by with 5 cords on an average winter with a new efficient unit. I currently have propane, so I can use that as backup and vacation/lazy heat.

Our two houses each burn 3-4 full cords in an average winter. The wood is normally cut in fall or spring, left as logs then blocked, split and burnt the following winter. for the first ten years we were here I burnt dead trees and windfalls. Now we have to cut live trees and let it age/dry.....Around here dry face cords sell for $80-$90 in December, $100-110 in March if you can find them....

My wood gets carried from the woodsheds to the front porches via tractor bucket about once a week....never burn more than one face/house / week...... Due for a new hip in late October so need to get organized by then.