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http://globalnews.ca/news/1939906/ca...8373c491b80e61
I haven't finished the article, and don't have time right now to go digging for past stories... but i vaguely remember a pitch a few years ago by Canadian farmers to buy the Wheat Board for MORE than the Feds are selling it to the Saudis for.
Massive strike against Harper's admin on this one.
Don't know anywhere near enough of that market/industry.
On one hand removing the monopoly sounds good on paper, as does the "promised" investments in infrastructure/opening of delivery. I seem to recall many complaints problems with it (WB) from growers over the years. If I read it right farmers will get a stake (share) and in 7 years those stakes might be repurchased. On the other I generally don't like the selling of things.
I also don't like the selling of assets which are suppose to protect Canadian interests but from what I understand the CWB was a jurisdictional monopsony (meaning farmers in the prairies and in some parts of BC had to sell to them only and no one else). That all changed back in 2012 where the federal government passed a bill which freed up the farmers who could only sell to the CWB and let them sell to anyone.
A tale of 3 crown assets being sold in the news today
Details of the Beer store shake up. Another monopoly losing its grip. I personally think its time and right. Good for you Ms Wynne
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/ca...-ontario-booze
Hydro 1 is official. 60% will be privatetized in order to pay for infrastructure
:madman::madman::madman::madman::madman::madman::m adman::madman::madman::madman::madman::madman: Isnt that what our tax dollars should have done these past 7 years?:scream:
And just because, I'll intentionally link the Stars opine.
http://www.thestar.com/opinion/lette...-interest.html
With respect to the Wheat board. I really don't know what to make of it. 6 of one, half dozen of another, like some of their decisions the jury may be out for years.
The stupid part of the hydro sell off is Wynne is already spending the billions the sale will bring in. HOW BOUT PAYING DOWN THE DEFECIT YOU DUMBASS.
That's the part i can't believe so few people are addressing.
oddmott,Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
Which comment are you referring to?
Hunter's.
The fact that Wynne (and JT will do the exact same if he gets in Federally) is leveling new tax after new tax and increasing the rates of most taxes and fees that already exist... under the auspices that the funds collected will go to the debt that requires repayment and the infrastructure that requires maintenance.
But that's not the case at all. Those funds just go into some black hole and are never seen again in any capacity that supports or benefits the citizenry.
I really haven't read up yet on this wheat board sale. First impressions sound disturbing. Not sure what the reasoning of letting the Saudis into our agriculture management means? I may be wrong but the Wheat board don't actually own any crops/futures or productive land? They are a marketing board that regulates pricing/supply/markets? Harper rarely plays the short game so somehow I'm sure this is all part of a bigger picture that likely involves oil down the road? Dunno?
Still not sure either and agree with the thought that breaking up a monopoly is usually a good thing . I do remember the WB getting pizzy whe the farmers no longer had to go through them to sell so hopefully this makes things easier and more profitable for them.
Correct. The taxes are nothing but redistribution of funds. The Liberals have a huge IOU that has come due. The Unions financed and facilitated the Liberal electoral wins and now it's payback time. Do you not think its interesting that carbon taxes are being introduced around the same time teacher contracts are being finalized? Anybody with a brain knows the revenue is not and never will be targeted to environmental initiatives. The only way these new taxes will reduce carbon is by over burdening the taxpayers and reducing discretionary income. This will shrink the economy and demand for all goods and services will shrink so eventually less energy will be needed. What people don't hear is that a shrinking economy means less jobs except for the PS who are insulated from the real world. Wynne is preparing to sell off 60% of Hydro for a one time cash infusion to balance a budget. Not lease it but sell it. My guess is the buyers have already been selected and could include the teacher's union and other Liberal friendly firms. What will she do the year after? sell the other 40% off? Doesn't anybody find it interesting that the two other jurisdictions she is partnering with ( Quebec, California) are also the worse performing economies and survive only because of Federal subsidies?Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
If anybody questions the math ( Like the Auditor General did) they are dismissed as stupid or the new tool calling everybody a homophobe. 3 more years of agenda driven destruction folks. Bury your guns and park your money offshore as fast as you can.
What TerryM said ... We are sunk!
I'm all for - and have contributed to - the bashing of the Libs mismanagement.
But, need to point out that my OP is 100% a Federal decision and sale.
Wynne & Trudough are interchangeable. One will support and live off the other. Getting back to the wheat board sale, I don't think we have had a chance to dissect that one yet........LoL.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
If there's any correlation it' simply looking at 3 related things. The reasons why they might be good and the reasons why it (selling of crown assets) may not.
1) breaking up the monopoly good, plausible benefits...jury will be out
2) breaking up two monopolies good, with no real dicernable upside or downside other than for beer/lcbo consumers.
3) breaking up a crown entity for "justifiable" reasons....but when one examines those reasons.
So with respect to the Wheat board, the arguments to be in favor of it are real/historical. The promised upsides (time will tell). But on the surface given the monopoly and historical problems and reasons. It seems "sound".
Jben,
Would wheat not be a trade-able commodity? How will the change in ownership of the board affect it's trading value? The way I see it whoever owns it is a moot point as nobody will want to make decisions that will reduce the producers/owners profits no? Can't see anybody actually making less money here? More of a political/ideology thing right? Money and math will decide direction no?
Control of a board that any level of authority over any Canadian industry should NEVER be sold off to a foreign corporation or nation. Ever.
JBen,Quote:
Originally Posted by JBen
The CWB monopoly (actually it was monopsony) was broken in 2012 when the feds passed a bill which allowed wheat farmers out west to sell to whomever they wanted to. Previously the western farmers had to sell to the CWB and no one else by law. So I am not sure what precipitated the selling of the CWB by the feds.
Dyth
Agreed. Especially to those oh so enlightened protectors of human rights the Saudi princes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
So does this board actually have much influence/value? Or did Harper throw them something shiny for future consideration and favors?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dythbringer
From my understanding, a lot of farmers were still selling to the CWB so I would have to say it did have a lot of influence (just not as much as it had prior to 2012).Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
The Wheat Board was continually under fire from the WTO which facillitated the break-up of the monopoly,so,I'm not sure what's happening with this. In that regard,you may be right. I can't see it being over oil because we have lot's of our own along with Natural Gas.Quote:
Originally Posted by terrym
Why not ? What about Canada post. It has been bleeding money for years and being kept afloat with taxpayer money. I dont know the financial status of the wheat board but if it makes sense to sell it and Canada and most importantly the farmers benefit from it I dont see the problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddmott
Again I know very little about the industry or the particular market. I don't see giving foreign interest a controlling stake as necessarily a bad thing here ( again don't know near enough). Most "Cdn" companies are foreign owned these days. It's been a few years but I think most protected industries have been done away with except possibly telecoms (still 10% ceiling for any single foreign owner).
Wheat, I assume like most commodities prices in the "fair market" ( and you'd have understand how market efficiency theory works) as well such things as intrinsic, cost of carry, and more, is likely largely affected by the futures contracts available. Not unlike Oil and so much more.
In theory (not sure what a "wheat lot is" maybe 100,000 tones") 1 futures contract is exactly = to 100,000 tonnes. Basically a buyer/seller wants to be indifferent whether they are farmers and have the physical wheat or a buyer of 1 contract they are exactly the same.
In theory nothing stops a farmer from selling 1 Sept wheat futures contract today ( at todays prices +/- factors like cost of carry which accounts for interest rates and more). Doing so locks in his price today. So he knows today exactly what that 100k tones of wheat is going to fetch come Sept. In essence is doesn't matter what the wheat board might set. Maybe they say thats
$100k per 100,000 tons
The farmer locked in today at 110k. If the wheat is worth more he "loses" upside potential…If in Sept its worth less, he's up money as theres no downside risk to him. Its a basic hedging/risk management tool. In a nutshell in Sept he delivers the physical wheat to the commodities exchange, and receives what he received for the futures "today". If delivery of the wheat is impossible, he covers his "short" (sale) position a couple days before.
If the Sept contract is trading at 125. He loses $15 on the futures trades, but gains it back when he sells the wheat at 125. Or if its at $80. He's up $30 on the futures trades.
Sell 1 contract at 110 today
Buy 1 contract at 80 on Sept 15th
Up 30
Sell his wheat on Sept 18th for 80.
One other thought on "why" Harper might be doing it or part of his reasoning. Dunno, just a stab.
A couple years ago if memory serves me right, we (Cda) got a bit icy with the Saudis, and there was a falling out. If I recall correctly it had something to do air travel, and number of flights or "something".. Since then things have been a bit icy on trade matters. This might be (just a wild stab) Harpers way of giving a little here, to gain there. Or part of it, dunno.
The wheat board is a nonissue. They no longer have any real control over wheat anyway so were basically reduced to being just one grain buyer among many. Selling it takes some pressure off in world trade issues and does absolutely nothing to harm farmers.